A landmark randomized trial put a fermented-soybean enzyme head-to-head with simvastatin — and on the one measure that predicts heart attacks and strokes, the pennies-a-day enzyme shrank plaque more than three times as much as the drug.
I got rid of Lyme using proteolytic enzymes. Not Nattokinase though, other enzymes. I took massive doses on an empty stomach and felt better than I ever did. Thanks for your fine work and cheers from DownUnder.
Hi, as I said, I got rid of Lyme by taking large doses of these enzymes. I hesitate to say exactly what brand (but I will) as I got pilloried (please excuse the pun) while I was still on Facebook and I had suggested people use these for Covid. It was over six years ago and I was still on FB and, on an astrology group, I said that using these enzymes would help with Covid. I left FB because of Covid - I couldn't stand the mask wearing, the boasting of having got the jabs, the putting down of those who didn't go along with the agenda, etc. I mention this as it was definitely (and no doubt still is) a major trigger for me. The biggest psyop in history (although I can think of a few others, it was the very definition of the biggest social manipulation through a lie).
Now, proteolytic enzymes, taken systemically (which means on an empty stomach and an hour or two both after and before eating) allows the protein enzymes to circulate throughout the blood and dissolve any protective lipid coating bacteria, viruses, fungal infections, etc., so that the body can 'digest' the detritus. It's quite extraordinary how they work. They no doubt work on blood clots and loads of other things that don't belong in the body.
I use Immune Defense from Enzymedica the Extra Strength one. I get it through iHerb. When I suggested this on FB all those years ago, I had several people yelling at me that I worked for the company and was getting a cut (when all I was doing was sharing what I know and now people are talking about these enzymes for Covid). Meanwhile, I'm an astrologer from Sydney Australia. People (in general) do not want to hear solutions - but yes, I hear people are here looking for answers which is great.
I took them when I'd get up to pee in the night, first thing in the morning or at random times when I wasn't going to be eating for a few hours. I didn't follow a protocol but would just take two, three, four or more at a time. I'd suggest that you start with taking one and then moving up with the dosage.
Thank you so much. I completely agree with you on the downsides of FB and I left there years ago and never looked back. I thank you for your sharing and I completely understand your being triggered. I hope this adds a softening to your harsh experience and impresses that there are people with open minds and hearts that want to know as much as they can about treating ourselves for things outside of mainstream.:)
Proteolytic enzymes? I’m not familiar with these… care to share more information? I keep all of these treatments and cures to give to anyone who needs them… 🙏🏽✝️🙏🏽
I'd love to see a good comparison of multiple proteolytic enzymes. Especially cost effectiveness. Bromelain is far less expensive than nattokinase. Lumbrokinase is in theory more powerful than nattokinase but even more expensive. A combination of using multiple enzymes seems wise to me!
Similar but with different emphasis. Bromelain is a cysteine protease, Nattokinase is a serine protease.
Bromelain is more for reducing inflammation with mild "blood thinning". Nattokinase is more for breaking down clots and reducing atherosclerotic plaques.
They are more complimentary than competitive. In other words for optimum health, I would recommend both.
How about 2 hydroxy-propyl beta cyclodextrin? See atherocare.com , cavadex.com , and heartfixer.com . I’ll be 77 years old next month. My blood lipids have been "horrible" my entire life (I maintain a 20+ year spreadsheet). I learned that I have severe atherosclerosis when I got my first cardiac CT in Feb 2020 at Mayo Jacksonville; it was 4122. I repeated the scan in Aug 2021 and my Coronary Artery Calcium (CAC) Score was up to 4576. My latest CAC Score in Nov 2023 was 6092, with most of the calcium in right coronary. (I hope that the rising scores simply indicate that my soft plaque is stabilizing). Increasing that latest score by 20% per year would put me around 10,500 a few months from now. CAC is a real measure of blocked arteries, not a debatable indicator like cholesterol or LDL. My brother and sister have both had bypass operations. I have NO interest in statins, stents, or surgery. Since 2020 I have tried every supplement, diet, and lifestyle change I could find any hope for. Those may or may not have improved anything, but at least they didn't make it any worse (since I am still alive). But what definitely helped me noticeably was starting to take 2 hydroxy propyl beta cyclodextrin in March 2025. Within a month I felt better and had no chest pain or shortness of breath (and only a few times since then). I think this stuff is fantastic. No prescription needed, and it's reasonably priced (relative to its benefits, and invasive alternatives). I kept records of every date I took a treatment, plus the retention period. I now exercise and walk more easily, often 3-5 miles per day. Currently I have taken 316 self-administered doses of 2hpbCD, primarily from www.Atherocare.com – as recommended to me by Dr Sircus https://drsircus.com/shop/ebooks/unclogging-your-arteries/ The only cardiologist in the US that I am aware of using this is Dr James Roberts and he has a lot of good data on his website https://www.heartfixer.com/IndexCHC.htm and https://www.heartfixer.com/CHC%20-%20Nattokinase.htm I agree with Dr Roberts that if Big pHarma and Big Gov't don't ban this treatment, it definitely has the potential to save millions of lives and billions of dollars. fwiw, I continue with my lifestyle changes, diet, exercise, and MANY supplements that I consider beneficial, such as high-dose natto (Nattovena and Neprinol), serrapeptase, POM juice, Linus Pauling protocol, nitric oxide boosters, chlorine dioxide plus DMSO, berberine, breathing exercises, Vit D + K, hydrogen gas, C15:0, grounding, red light therapy, PEMF, etc. Can you please do an interview with Dr Roberts about 2hpbCD. PLEASE take a look at this. Thank you, and Best Wishes.
I am waiting for open heart surgery for replacement of the mitral valve due to mitral stenosis. Also by pass of artery with 70% blockage. I refused statins and opted for increased Nattokinase, 12,000 fu. It took about a month but I noted a remarkable improvement as I no longer had extreme shortage of breath. Not perfect, but I feel I am more able to cope while waiting for surgery. Am hoping the 70% blockage will be noticeably decreased by the time of surgery. I appreciate your researched based articles.
My ADMA blood test showed great improvement after increasing my Nattokinese from 2000 FUs to 8000 FUs over the past 6 months. My original result was 107, where over 100 may be problematic. It is now at 90. Nattokinese definitely helped my cardio!!
I have the same question but I guess the answer seems obvious. I started using natto and am herbal blend of Black Walnut, Wormwood, Garlic and Clove and my badly swollen and clotted leg (from Lymes) resolved.
Husband who had rare, occasional Afib. He had an ablation and was put on Eliquis "for life, you are a cardiac patient." We never went back to that cardiologist and husband has used nattokinaise 10,000 fu for 2 years with no problem. We do assume all responsibility for what we consider an informed decision.
What I found out, over the last 60years, that Nature heals! And never go back to the lifestyle, that made you sick in the first place! Poison, that is in the body, has to come out, so that Nature can do, what is possible with wholesome nutrition!
Same thing they did to Dr. Nicholas Gonzalez and his Cancer treatment. Pretend to run a clinical trail, but do not, at all, mimic the perimeters used with Dr. Gonzalez's protocol. The protocol, he had success with. Then declare those treatments, in effective.
I was a patient of Dr. Gonzalez for over 20 years. You are absolutely correct about what they did to him and the tragedy that was for him and for all of us.
This sure does debunk the lipid myth of heart disease which began with the makers of Crisco heavily funding (some would say "founding") the American Heart Association, an organization which originally said that people should begin eating more Crisco, because it does not have the saturated fat and cholesterol found in butter.
a typo:
---------------------------------------------
But like I catch myself doing sometimes, you made a faux paus (subtle error or oversight) in typing this thing up. It is where you said this:
" the statin group should have had less plaque.
They had more than three times as much. "
As you had correctly stated prior, the drop was 3x -- but the final amounts were actually closer to each other (the final amounts didn't differ by 3x).
The carotid plaque that the statin group had at the end of the study was somewhere in the vicinity of 0.18 or 0.19 square centimeters, while the carotid plaque that the nattokinase group had was somewhere in the vicinity of 0.14 or 0.15 square centimeters -- i.e., the combined average of all 76 persons (39 nattokinase + 37 statin) was 0.16 square centimeters of plaque.
To get the weighted average to come out to 0.16 for both groups combined, the nattokinase group will be below 0.16 but a little closer to 0.16 than the statin group (which would be above 0.16 by a little more than the nattokinase group was below 0.16).
----------------------------------------------
NOTE: If you agree with the point, I will delete the above if you would like.
And that point about increasing HDL is crucial, because increases in HDL are "more powerful" than decreases in LDL when trying to cut the risk. Only the small, dense LDL is harmful, and high-fat diets have even lowered the small, dense LDL (even if overall LDL rises).
This is an interesting comparison, particularly because nattokinase has attracted considerable attention as a potential cardiovascular supplement. As a physician-scientist, I think it’s important, however, to distinguish between biological activity, biomarker changes, and demonstrated clinical benefit. Nattokinase has plausible mechanisms involving fibrinolysis and coagulation pathways, but that doesn’t automatically translate into the same cardiovascular outcomes we have established for statins. Statins have decades of randomized trial data demonstrating reductions in myocardial infarction, stroke, and cardiovascular mortality in appropriate populations. A supplement showing effects on LDL, blood pressure, or coagulation markers is not equivalent to demonstrating prevention of cardiovascular events. At the same time, I think studies like this are valuable as they generate hypotheses and remind us that there may be underexplored compounds worth investigating. The key next step is rigorous head-to-head research with clinically meaningful endpoints, adequate sample sizes, and long-term follow-up. The broader lesson is an important one for preventive medicine: mechanism is where a hypothesis begins, not where evidence ends. The real question is always whether an intervention ultimately helps people live longer, healthier lives with fewer cardiovascular events. That’s where the science becomes truly consequential.
Hell may freeze over or at least we seniors will be dead before there "is rigorous head-to-head research with clinically meaningful endpoints, adequate sample sizes, and long-term follow-up." We all understand why. There is often no discussion re: the lack of association or an inverse association between LDL and mortality in the elderly >60. It is about the demonstrated clinical benefit. This is not a the population who has already had a cardiac event.
The research now on statins show they only save a person one week of life after being on a statin for years. The side effects of statins are horrendous and can leave people terribly crippled. Isn't it much wiser to change diet and lifestyle to improve health than use these harmful medications?
My wife lost quad muscle and strength after years on statins. Myopathy was ignored by both her PCPs when my wife complained about nightly severe pain in her quads. At 2 a.m., like clockwork.
My brother is on a statin and has developed mild dementia. At least his PCP recognized the problem.
You're never going to get large trials of supplements. It's been tried and journals won't publish. Pharma is the major revenue source of journals and supplements compete with pharma products. So, the best plan is "Won't hurt, might help, see if it helps you." Folk medicine is the way forward.
I got rid of Lyme using proteolytic enzymes. Not Nattokinase though, other enzymes. I took massive doses on an empty stomach and felt better than I ever did. Thanks for your fine work and cheers from DownUnder.
Hi, as I said, I got rid of Lyme by taking large doses of these enzymes. I hesitate to say exactly what brand (but I will) as I got pilloried (please excuse the pun) while I was still on Facebook and I had suggested people use these for Covid. It was over six years ago and I was still on FB and, on an astrology group, I said that using these enzymes would help with Covid. I left FB because of Covid - I couldn't stand the mask wearing, the boasting of having got the jabs, the putting down of those who didn't go along with the agenda, etc. I mention this as it was definitely (and no doubt still is) a major trigger for me. The biggest psyop in history (although I can think of a few others, it was the very definition of the biggest social manipulation through a lie).
Now, proteolytic enzymes, taken systemically (which means on an empty stomach and an hour or two both after and before eating) allows the protein enzymes to circulate throughout the blood and dissolve any protective lipid coating bacteria, viruses, fungal infections, etc., so that the body can 'digest' the detritus. It's quite extraordinary how they work. They no doubt work on blood clots and loads of other things that don't belong in the body.
I use Immune Defense from Enzymedica the Extra Strength one. I get it through iHerb. When I suggested this on FB all those years ago, I had several people yelling at me that I worked for the company and was getting a cut (when all I was doing was sharing what I know and now people are talking about these enzymes for Covid). Meanwhile, I'm an astrologer from Sydney Australia. People (in general) do not want to hear solutions - but yes, I hear people are here looking for answers which is great.
I took them when I'd get up to pee in the night, first thing in the morning or at random times when I wasn't going to be eating for a few hours. I didn't follow a protocol but would just take two, three, four or more at a time. I'd suggest that you start with taking one and then moving up with the dosage.
Thank you so much. I completely agree with you on the downsides of FB and I left there years ago and never looked back. I thank you for your sharing and I completely understand your being triggered. I hope this adds a softening to your harsh experience and impresses that there are people with open minds and hearts that want to know as much as they can about treating ourselves for things outside of mainstream.:)
Smart use of systemic enzymes. After hearing that, it makes sense they would work on many different things that "don't belong in the body."
Proteolytic enzymes? I’m not familiar with these… care to share more information? I keep all of these treatments and cures to give to anyone who needs them… 🙏🏽✝️🙏🏽
yes, please share the proteolytic enzymes you used. so many struggling with Lyme
I'd love to see a good comparison of multiple proteolytic enzymes. Especially cost effectiveness. Bromelain is far less expensive than nattokinase. Lumbrokinase is in theory more powerful than nattokinase but even more expensive. A combination of using multiple enzymes seems wise to me!
Can bromelain do a similar job to nattokinase?
Similar but with different emphasis. Bromelain is a cysteine protease, Nattokinase is a serine protease.
Bromelain is more for reducing inflammation with mild "blood thinning". Nattokinase is more for breaking down clots and reducing atherosclerotic plaques.
They are more complimentary than competitive. In other words for optimum health, I would recommend both.
Thank you.
How about 2 hydroxy-propyl beta cyclodextrin? See atherocare.com , cavadex.com , and heartfixer.com . I’ll be 77 years old next month. My blood lipids have been "horrible" my entire life (I maintain a 20+ year spreadsheet). I learned that I have severe atherosclerosis when I got my first cardiac CT in Feb 2020 at Mayo Jacksonville; it was 4122. I repeated the scan in Aug 2021 and my Coronary Artery Calcium (CAC) Score was up to 4576. My latest CAC Score in Nov 2023 was 6092, with most of the calcium in right coronary. (I hope that the rising scores simply indicate that my soft plaque is stabilizing). Increasing that latest score by 20% per year would put me around 10,500 a few months from now. CAC is a real measure of blocked arteries, not a debatable indicator like cholesterol or LDL. My brother and sister have both had bypass operations. I have NO interest in statins, stents, or surgery. Since 2020 I have tried every supplement, diet, and lifestyle change I could find any hope for. Those may or may not have improved anything, but at least they didn't make it any worse (since I am still alive). But what definitely helped me noticeably was starting to take 2 hydroxy propyl beta cyclodextrin in March 2025. Within a month I felt better and had no chest pain or shortness of breath (and only a few times since then). I think this stuff is fantastic. No prescription needed, and it's reasonably priced (relative to its benefits, and invasive alternatives). I kept records of every date I took a treatment, plus the retention period. I now exercise and walk more easily, often 3-5 miles per day. Currently I have taken 316 self-administered doses of 2hpbCD, primarily from www.Atherocare.com – as recommended to me by Dr Sircus https://drsircus.com/shop/ebooks/unclogging-your-arteries/ The only cardiologist in the US that I am aware of using this is Dr James Roberts and he has a lot of good data on his website https://www.heartfixer.com/IndexCHC.htm and https://www.heartfixer.com/CHC%20-%20Nattokinase.htm I agree with Dr Roberts that if Big pHarma and Big Gov't don't ban this treatment, it definitely has the potential to save millions of lives and billions of dollars. fwiw, I continue with my lifestyle changes, diet, exercise, and MANY supplements that I consider beneficial, such as high-dose natto (Nattovena and Neprinol), serrapeptase, POM juice, Linus Pauling protocol, nitric oxide boosters, chlorine dioxide plus DMSO, berberine, breathing exercises, Vit D + K, hydrogen gas, C15:0, grounding, red light therapy, PEMF, etc. Can you please do an interview with Dr Roberts about 2hpbCD. PLEASE take a look at this. Thank you, and Best Wishes.
Thanks for this post. It is all new to me, and interesting. Good luck and good health to you!
Thank you for sharing the details of your self help discoveries. Agree, an interview with Dr. Roberts could prove to be most helpful. God bless you!
What about Japanese people who benefit from lowered cardiovascular issues while eating one serving of natto a day? This would not be 6000 FU. Thanks!
It’s about time this comes out. Thanks for the information.
Hmm... I thought it "came out" twenty years ago... but yes, few people are aware of these things!
What, no citations? No endnotes? Please add.
I am waiting for open heart surgery for replacement of the mitral valve due to mitral stenosis. Also by pass of artery with 70% blockage. I refused statins and opted for increased Nattokinase, 12,000 fu. It took about a month but I noted a remarkable improvement as I no longer had extreme shortage of breath. Not perfect, but I feel I am more able to cope while waiting for surgery. Am hoping the 70% blockage will be noticeably decreased by the time of surgery. I appreciate your researched based articles.
My ADMA blood test showed great improvement after increasing my Nattokinese from 2000 FUs to 8000 FUs over the past 6 months. My original result was 107, where over 100 may be problematic. It is now at 90. Nattokinese definitely helped my cardio!!
Is this a lifetime commitment, or once you’ve reduced your calcification, can you wean off? Ty!
What about replacing blood thinners like eluquis being used for Afib?
I have the same question but I guess the answer seems obvious. I started using natto and am herbal blend of Black Walnut, Wormwood, Garlic and Clove and my badly swollen and clotted leg (from Lymes) resolved.
I got rid of Lyme with proteolytic enzymes. They are amazing.
Husband who had rare, occasional Afib. He had an ablation and was put on Eliquis "for life, you are a cardiac patient." We never went back to that cardiologist and husband has used nattokinaise 10,000 fu for 2 years with no problem. We do assume all responsibility for what we consider an informed decision.
I like your Q.
What I found out, over the last 60years, that Nature heals! And never go back to the lifestyle, that made you sick in the first place! Poison, that is in the body, has to come out, so that Nature can do, what is possible with wholesome nutrition!
Same thing they did to Dr. Nicholas Gonzalez and his Cancer treatment. Pretend to run a clinical trail, but do not, at all, mimic the perimeters used with Dr. Gonzalez's protocol. The protocol, he had success with. Then declare those treatments, in effective.
Same with Ivermectin.
Rinse and repeat.
I was a patient of Dr. Gonzalez for over 20 years. You are absolutely correct about what they did to him and the tragedy that was for him and for all of us.
Sayer,
This sure does debunk the lipid myth of heart disease which began with the makers of Crisco heavily funding (some would say "founding") the American Heart Association, an organization which originally said that people should begin eating more Crisco, because it does not have the saturated fat and cholesterol found in butter.
a typo:
---------------------------------------------
But like I catch myself doing sometimes, you made a faux paus (subtle error or oversight) in typing this thing up. It is where you said this:
" the statin group should have had less plaque.
They had more than three times as much. "
As you had correctly stated prior, the drop was 3x -- but the final amounts were actually closer to each other (the final amounts didn't differ by 3x).
The carotid plaque that the statin group had at the end of the study was somewhere in the vicinity of 0.18 or 0.19 square centimeters, while the carotid plaque that the nattokinase group had was somewhere in the vicinity of 0.14 or 0.15 square centimeters -- i.e., the combined average of all 76 persons (39 nattokinase + 37 statin) was 0.16 square centimeters of plaque.
To get the weighted average to come out to 0.16 for both groups combined, the nattokinase group will be below 0.16 but a little closer to 0.16 than the statin group (which would be above 0.16 by a little more than the nattokinase group was below 0.16).
----------------------------------------------
NOTE: If you agree with the point, I will delete the above if you would like.
And that point about increasing HDL is crucial, because increases in HDL are "more powerful" than decreases in LDL when trying to cut the risk. Only the small, dense LDL is harmful, and high-fat diets have even lowered the small, dense LDL (even if overall LDL rises).
Take on empty stomach?
Can this help?
2-hydroxypropyl-β-cyclodextrin reduces atherosclerotic plaques in human coronary artery
Yes! Absolutely take enzymes on an empty stomach to get systemic benefits!
The book, Your Doctor is a lier (see intro,@ https://www.amazon.com/dp/B002D61814?lv=shuf&channelId=510&plpRedirect=mhFallback) Uese the prodects insert packet to discrediet lipitor, I.e. it can kill & harm you [very limited benifits for very limited people] but it can't effect save you or your mortaliety!
This is an interesting comparison, particularly because nattokinase has attracted considerable attention as a potential cardiovascular supplement. As a physician-scientist, I think it’s important, however, to distinguish between biological activity, biomarker changes, and demonstrated clinical benefit. Nattokinase has plausible mechanisms involving fibrinolysis and coagulation pathways, but that doesn’t automatically translate into the same cardiovascular outcomes we have established for statins. Statins have decades of randomized trial data demonstrating reductions in myocardial infarction, stroke, and cardiovascular mortality in appropriate populations. A supplement showing effects on LDL, blood pressure, or coagulation markers is not equivalent to demonstrating prevention of cardiovascular events. At the same time, I think studies like this are valuable as they generate hypotheses and remind us that there may be underexplored compounds worth investigating. The key next step is rigorous head-to-head research with clinically meaningful endpoints, adequate sample sizes, and long-term follow-up. The broader lesson is an important one for preventive medicine: mechanism is where a hypothesis begins, not where evidence ends. The real question is always whether an intervention ultimately helps people live longer, healthier lives with fewer cardiovascular events. That’s where the science becomes truly consequential.
Thank you!
Hell may freeze over or at least we seniors will be dead before there "is rigorous head-to-head research with clinically meaningful endpoints, adequate sample sizes, and long-term follow-up." We all understand why. There is often no discussion re: the lack of association or an inverse association between LDL and mortality in the elderly >60. It is about the demonstrated clinical benefit. This is not a the population who has already had a cardiac event.
The research now on statins show they only save a person one week of life after being on a statin for years. The side effects of statins are horrendous and can leave people terribly crippled. Isn't it much wiser to change diet and lifestyle to improve health than use these harmful medications?
My wife lost quad muscle and strength after years on statins. Myopathy was ignored by both her PCPs when my wife complained about nightly severe pain in her quads. At 2 a.m., like clockwork.
My brother is on a statin and has developed mild dementia. At least his PCP recognized the problem.
You're never going to get large trials of supplements. It's been tried and journals won't publish. Pharma is the major revenue source of journals and supplements compete with pharma products. So, the best plan is "Won't hurt, might help, see if it helps you." Folk medicine is the way forward.